[rescue] Help with Sun 3's
Daniel Salive
two32 at hotmail.com
Tue Dec 25 21:50:43 CST 2018
Wow! Thanks for the responses everyone! Merry Christmas as well.
I tried to get a little further with this yesterday and could not find my
null-modem cable, and since both the wyse 60 I have and the sun 3 use female
db-25 connectors, and all of the cables I could find here are also female, I
had no luck hooking anything to anything else. A friend of mine has the one
I had previously mentioned using, and I plan on getting it from him tomorrow,
and giving this a go tomorrow afternoon.
The documentation and instruction everyone has provided here will be very
helpful! I do know a bit about electronics, though less than I'd like to
know. I have some basic componentry, a multimeter, and a soldering iron here,
so I should be able to figure out a cable, even if that means building it
myself instead of waiting for one to show up from amazon.
Once I can get these displaying the banner screen, then I'll move on to
figuring out if they'll display on a monitor/keyboard, new PROM batteries and
making them talk to the big external SCSI drives they came with!
--Daniel Salive
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Today's Topics:
1. Re: Help with Sun 3's (Peter Stokes)
2. Re: Help with Sun 3's (Mouse)
3. Re: Help with Sun 3's (Mike Spooner)
4. Re: Help with Sun 3's (Mike Spooner)
5. Re: Help with Sun 3's (Mike Loewen)
6. Re: Help with Sun 3's (Mike Loewen)
7. Re: looking for titanium powerbook (Andrew Luke Nesbit)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Mon, 24 Dec 2018 18:06:05 +0000
From: Peter Stokes <peter at ashlyn.co.uk>
To: The Rescue List <rescue at sunhelp.org>
Subject: Re: [rescue] Help with Sun 3's
Message-ID: <14EE0CCC-34F4-47CA-9F6D-3DADD92B59FB at ashlyn.co.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Hi Daniel
As far as the serial port is concerned, I think mouse has it covered, always
a
pain unless you have a known working cable.
Not sure if the old handbook with all the docs for the Sun 3s and diag info
for the lights is available online. I know the 3s were deleted from the paper
handbook at some point. If you need any scans of them, I could do it, but
hoping some are already online (anyone know?).
Peter
Sent from my iPad
> On 24 Dec 2018, at 14:30, Daniel Salive <two32 at hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> Hey guys! New here. Recently acquired a few sun 3's (mostly 3/60's, but
some
> 3/50's and a 3/110) and can't get any of them to boot.
>
> I've tried both with a monitor and with a serial terminal using a 25 pin to
9
> pin null modem cable and then a 9 to 25 adapter so I had 25 on both ends.
> I have many to pick from, and most of them were known to be working when
taken
> out of service, though that was likely 20 years ago. I've opened them up
and
> looked inside and the majority of them have no obvious internal problems.
>
> I have never used a sun 3 before, and rarely used other UNIX stuff, so all
> this is new to me.
>
> Most of them have all the red LED lights light up on the back, though a few
> only light up 3 (which 3 I forget, though I can look into it more when I
try
> again). But no output to either the monitor or the serial terminal.
>
> I waited a long time to see if systems would come up, but still nothing.
>
> Any ideas what could be wrong here?
> _______________________________________________
> rescue list - http://www.sunhelp.org/mailman/listinfo/rescue
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Mon, 24 Dec 2018 13:56:21 -0500 (EST)
From: Mouse <mouse at Rodents-Montreal.ORG>
To: The Rescue List <rescue at sunhelp.org>
Subject: Re: [rescue] Help with Sun 3's
Message-ID: <201812241856.NAA06425 at Stone.Rodents-Montreal.ORG>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>> [-3/60s a diagnostic LEDs]
> Not sure if the old handbook with all the docs for the Sun 3s and
> diag info for the lights is available online.
It was at one point;
http://www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/~alanb/faq/Sun-Hardware-2.faq
included diagnostic light patterns for, among others, the -3/60. (It's
still there now, but it's served without a Content-Type: and isn't HTML
and thus might not be very usable with a Web browser. If you can "view
source" or equivalent, it may be more readable.)
Here's the table for -3/60s from that. I don't have any other
reference to check this against; my -3/60s are in storage at the
moment.
3/60,3/60LE
Bit 0 is on the right. The pattern is shown as it appears on the
LEDs.
Pattern Status
-------- ------
11111111 Resetting
00000001 PROM checksum test
00000011 Context register test
00000100 Segment map read/write test
00000101 Segment map address test
00000110 Page map test
00000111 Memory path data test
00001000 Nonexistent memory bus error test
00001001 Interrupt test
00001010 Time-Of-Day clock interrupt test
00001011 MMU protection/status tests
00001110 Parity error test #1
00001111 Parity error test #2
00010000 Memory test
10000000 Self-tests have found an error
01000000 An exception class error occurred
The last two lines are ORed into the other patterns, so that (for
example) 01001010 indicates an unexpected exception during the TOD
clock interrupt test. 00100000 blinking apparently indicates that it's
in the ROM monitor, either trying to interact with a human or trying to
boot.
Most OSes put an animated pattern of some sort on the LEDs once they
boot, but it sounds as though you're a long way from being concerned
about that.
/~\ The ASCII Mouse
\ / Ribbon Campaign
X Against HTML mouse at rodents-montreal.org
/ \ Email! 7D C8 61 52 5D E7 2D 39 4E F1 31 3E E8 B3 27 4B
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Mon, 24 Dec 2018 20:56:48 +0000
From: Mike Spooner <mike.spooner.ux at gmail.com>
To: The Rescue List <rescue at sunhelp.org>
Subject: Re: [rescue] Help with Sun 3's
Message-ID:
<CAAa1pV4H20qRfbdW_Wntvwv0UDdQvjjomW2Z8azLkZV4Esjd=A at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Sun 3 Hardware Handbook is available online:
http://www.shrubbery.net/~heas/sun-feh-2_1/Systems/Sun3/FEH3.enter.html
Regards,
Mike
On Mon, 24 Dec 2018 at 18:06, Peter Stokes <peter at ashlyn.co.uk> wrote:
> Hi Daniel
>
> As far as the serial port is concerned, I think mouse has it covered,
> always a
> pain unless you have a known working cable.
>
> Not sure if the old handbook with all the docs for the Sun 3s and diag info
> for the lights is available online. I know the 3s were deleted from the
> paper
> handbook at some point. If you need any scans of them, I could do it, but
> hoping some are already online (anyone know?).
>
> Peter
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> > On 24 Dec 2018, at 14:30, Daniel Salive <two32 at hotmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > Hey guys! New here. Recently acquired a few sun 3's (mostly 3/60's, but
> some
> > 3/50's and a 3/110) and can't get any of them to boot.
> >
> > I've tried both with a monitor and with a serial terminal using a 25 pin
> to
> 9
> > pin null modem cable and then a 9 to 25 adapter so I had 25 on both
> ends.
> > I have many to pick from, and most of them were known to be working when
> taken
> > out of service, though that was likely 20 years ago. I've opened them up
> and
> > looked inside and the majority of them have no obvious internal problems.
> >
> > I have never used a sun 3 before, and rarely used other UNIX stuff, so
> all
> > this is new to me.
> >
> > Most of them have all the red LED lights light up on the back, though a
> few
> > only light up 3 (which 3 I forget, though I can look into it more when I
> try
> > again). But no output to either the monitor or the serial terminal.
> >
> > I waited a long time to see if systems would come up, but still nothing.
> >
> > Any ideas what could be wrong here?
> > _______________________________________________
> > rescue list - http://www.sunhelp.org/mailman/listinfo/rescue
> _______________________________________________
> rescue list - http://www.sunhelp.org/mailman/listinfo/rescue
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Mon, 24 Dec 2018 20:59:00 +0000
From: Mike Spooner <mike.spooner.ux at gmail.com>
To: The Rescue List <rescue at sunhelp.org>
Subject: Re: [rescue] Help with Sun 3's
Message-ID:
<CAAa1pV7UjAz8+pxfi5UD81K8rj74xu9aSSVGq+2sUboNPj_tVA at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Useful reference: Sun 3/60 on-board serial-port pinout:
http://www.shrubbery.net/~heas/sun-feh-2_1/Systems/Sun3/TrCOMM_01_CPU-Serial-
Ports.html
Regards,
Mike
On Mon, 24 Dec 2018 at 18:06, Peter Stokes <peter at ashlyn.co.uk> wrote:
> Hi Daniel
>
> As far as the serial port is concerned, I think mouse has it covered,
> always a
> pain unless you have a known working cable.
>
> Not sure if the old handbook with all the docs for the Sun 3s and diag info
> for the lights is available online. I know the 3s were deleted from the
> paper
> handbook at some point. If you need any scans of them, I could do it, but
> hoping some are already online (anyone know?).
>
> Peter
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> > On 24 Dec 2018, at 14:30, Daniel Salive <two32 at hotmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > Hey guys! New here. Recently acquired a few sun 3's (mostly 3/60's, but
> some
> > 3/50's and a 3/110) and can't get any of them to boot.
> >
> > I've tried both with a monitor and with a serial terminal using a 25 pin
> to
> 9
> > pin null modem cable and then a 9 to 25 adapter so I had 25 on both
> ends.
> > I have many to pick from, and most of them were known to be working when
> taken
> > out of service, though that was likely 20 years ago. I've opened them up
> and
> > looked inside and the majority of them have no obvious internal problems.
> >
> > I have never used a sun 3 before, and rarely used other UNIX stuff, so
> all
> > this is new to me.
> >
> > Most of them have all the red LED lights light up on the back, though a
> few
> > only light up 3 (which 3 I forget, though I can look into it more when I
> try
> > again). But no output to either the monitor or the serial terminal.
> >
> > I waited a long time to see if systems would come up, but still nothing.
> >
> > Any ideas what could be wrong here?
> > _______________________________________________
> > rescue list - http://www.sunhelp.org/mailman/listinfo/rescue
> _______________________________________________
> rescue list - http://www.sunhelp.org/mailman/listinfo/rescue
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Mon, 24 Dec 2018 16:04:58 -0500 (EST)
From: Mike Loewen <mloewen at cpumagic.scol.pa.us>
To: The Rescue List <rescue at sunhelp.org>
Subject: Re: [rescue] Help with Sun 3's
Message-ID:
<alpine.LFD.2.21.1812241601131.11686 at cpumagic.137clearview.org>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed
The Sun 3/60 Installation Manual is on Bitsavers:
http://www.bitsavers.org/pdf/sun/sun3/3-60/800-1987-05_Sun-3_60_Installation_
Manual.pdf
It lists the diagnostic LED patterns and serial port (DTE) pinouts. I
didn't see anything there about a serial console, but I haven't actually
worked with a 3/60 since 1990.
On Mon, 24 Dec 2018, Peter Stokes wrote:
> Hi Daniel
>
> As far as the serial port is concerned, I think mouse has it covered, always
a
> pain unless you have a known working cable.
>
> Not sure if the old handbook with all the docs for the Sun 3s and diag info
> for the lights is available online. I know the 3s were deleted from the
paper
> handbook at some point. If you need any scans of them, I could do it, but
> hoping some are already online (anyone know?).
>
> Peter
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
>> On 24 Dec 2018, at 14:30, Daniel Salive <two32 at hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> Hey guys! New here. Recently acquired a few sun 3's (mostly 3/60's, but
> some
>> 3/50's and a 3/110) and can't get any of them to boot.
>>
>> I've tried both with a monitor and with a serial terminal using a 25 pin
to
> 9
>> pin null modem cable and then a 9 to 25 adapter so I had 25 on both ends.
>> I have many to pick from, and most of them were known to be working when
> taken
>> out of service, though that was likely 20 years ago. I've opened them up
> and
>> looked inside and the majority of them have no obvious internal problems.
>>
>> I have never used a sun 3 before, and rarely used other UNIX stuff, so all
>> this is new to me.
>>
>> Most of them have all the red LED lights light up on the back, though a
few
>> only light up 3 (which 3 I forget, though I can look into it more when I
> try
>> again). But no output to either the monitor or the serial terminal.
>>
>> I waited a long time to see if systems would come up, but still nothing.
>>
>> Any ideas what could be wrong here?
>> _______________________________________________
>> rescue list - http://www.sunhelp.org/mailman/listinfo/rescue
> _______________________________________________
> rescue list - http://www.sunhelp.org/mailman/listinfo/rescue
>
Mike Loewen mloewen at cpumagic.scol.pa.us
Old Technology http://q7.neurotica.com/Oldtech/
------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Mon, 24 Dec 2018 16:22:17 -0500 (EST)
From: Mike Loewen <mloewen at cpumagic.scol.pa.us>
To: The Rescue List <rescue at sunhelp.org>
Subject: Re: [rescue] Help with Sun 3's
Message-ID:
<alpine.LFD.2.21.1812241618050.11686 at cpumagic.137clearview.org>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=US-ASCII
On Mon, 24 Dec 2018, Mike Loewen wrote:
> The Sun 3/60 Installation Manual is on Bitsavers:
>
>
http://www.bitsavers.org/pdf/sun/sun3/3-60/800-1987-05_Sun-3_60_Installation_
Manual.pdf
>
> It lists the diagnostic LED patterns and serial port (DTE) pinouts. I
> didn't see anything there about a serial console, but I haven't actually
> worked with a 3/60 since 1990.
Also, this document discusses modifying the EEPROM settings in Diag mode
for a serial console and netboot:
http://jonsip.sdf.org/netboot.txt
...and this one lists common EEPROM locations:
https://www.sun3arc.org/FEH/CPU/prommon.phtml
Mike Loewen mloewen at cpumagic.scol.pa.us
Old Technology http://q7.neurotica.com/Oldtech/
------------------------------
Message: 7
Date: Mon, 24 Dec 2018 22:11:57 +0000
From: Andrew Luke Nesbit <ullbeking at andrewnesbit.org>
To: The Rescue List <rescue at sunhelp.org>, Hauke Fath
<hauke at Espresso.Rhein-Neckar.DE>
Subject: Re: [rescue] looking for titanium powerbook
Message-ID: <88ac3f03-036d-423c-9e9c-14ddce0be68b at andrewnesbit.org>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
On 23/12/2018 21:56, Hauke Fath wrote:
> I had a GBit G4/550 PowerBook back in the days(*), and these buggers run
> awfully hot - 3rd party fan trays were all the rage at the time.
I had a PowerBook G4 667 MHz (DVI TiBook). It was one of the best
computers I ever had and I sure would love to afford a replacement (not
necessarily the exact same.
I noticed that it would get get _very_ hot too. Sometimes this
concerned me and I would wonder whether something was actually wrong
with with my computer.
Hauke, what are these "3rd party fan trays"? In case I am fortunate
enough to procure another TiBook, I'd like to investigate.
Could you point me to a link please?
> I find my
> G3 Pismo a lot more pleasant to handle, and it certainly has enough power
> for System 9, if you can do without a cdrom writer.
I never had a G3 but one of these is also on my "to do" list as I get
more re-acquianted with PowerPC. I have missed it very much.
> I don't know about the battery situation though.
Are you referring to the possibility/difficulty of finding a battery
that is in suitably good condition?
Andrew
--
OpenPGP key: EB28 0338 28B7 19DA DAB0 B193 D21D 996E 883B E5B9
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