[geeks] Liber-fascism

[Jonathan C. Patschke]

On Sat, 25 Oct 2008, der Mouse wrote:

> I didn't write the double-quoted text above, but it seems obvious to me
> that the answer tothe single-quoted text is "nobody has found any other
> way to support the kind of population density that's inevitable at
> today's population without that".

That seems more an argument for reducing population than anything else.
If we can't continue to have 3 or 4 children per family without resorting
to violence to keep things tidy, people should have fewer children.  So
far, I'm doing my part.

> The farm you cited as an example works only because there is a
> government, with its threat of deadly force backing it, preventing the
> local brigands that would otherwise overrun your farm from existing.

Actually, that's where you're wrong.  The local law enforcement is
useless.  To see a complete tally of what all was stolen from there before
I took it over would make most folks cry.  The previous owner had a
conversation with the sheriff's department like this:

   $owner:   Someone is stealing my tractor, he's at my farm at $address,
             and he's loading it onto a flatbed trailer right now!
   Sheriff:  Oh yeah?  Do you know the guy?
   $owner:   Yeah, he's $guy.
   Sheriff:  Oh...Oh!  Well, uh, that's a civil matter, then. *click*

I have personal knowledge of this, as I am related to the previous owner.

I do not believe that the mythical force of "government" maintains the
place so much as that most people aren't thieves that need a higher dose
of lead and brass in their diet.

> Indeed, the local brigands - and the banding-together of people to
> defend against their ilk - are the first rudimentary governments.

Banding together in a common defense is a far cry from what we have now.
That may have been the original intent, but my personal experience with
the system is that it's entirely useless as a mechanism for defense.  I
was mugged in Houston (cops won't deal with it "It's probably just some
homeless guy"), my relative had just about everything that wasn't bolted
down (and some things that were) stolen from the farm, I've yet to see any
sort of justice for having some crazy guy smash on my face with a 3/4"
socket.

Defense is something you buy and keep loaded near the door or bed.

> If you don't like governments, I suggest you leave.

The governments have set up rules by which they claim to govern
themselves.  These rules include guarantees of certain liberties.  Many of
these liberties they, themselves violate.  Indeed, many of those founding
documents claim that governments derive their power solely from the
consent of the governed.

I've yet to explicitly give my consent.  I daresay that absolutely no one
could give informed consent to that.  The laws themselves number in the
hundreds of thousands of pages for any locale in the US.  Beyond that,
there are court decisions which "interpret" (read as: modify, broaden, or
narrow the effect of) those laws.  As it is, our legislature isn't even
required to read the laws before passing them!

I know from speaking with other friends of mine from Canada that the
Canadian Parliament isn't quite as out of control as the US Congress.  Our
congressmen don't write the bills they propose (they have employees for
that, who take a good bit of their input from lobbyists).  The congressmen
very rarely read a bill in its entirely before voting on it.  A full
reading before a quorum isn't required, and any one bill can modify any
number of completely unrelated sections of the public law.

Going back to my assertion that humans have a right to invoke violence or
harm on each other only in the case that the victim has given informed
consent, I declare the government to be illegitimate.  There is no one:
not one man, woman, or child; not one scholar, attorney, justice, or
magistrate that can know the whole body of laws that the government claims
governs him, should he live within the US.  Should the government flow
from the consent of the governed, and should only informed consent be
truly considered as consent, there is no government.

And the US is really just the crazed end of it all.  Do governments really
get smaller anywhere?  In a number decades, all governments either end up
in this form of madness or in military defeat.

> Just don't expect anyone to come to your rescue when a bigger - or
> better-armed - band of people overrun you; that's something governments
> do.

Not so much.  That's something I already have to expect to handle on my
own.

-- 
Jonathan Patschke | "There is more to life than increasing its speed."
Elgin, TX         |                                   --Mahatma Gandhi
USA               |