[geeks] Bill Cosby's Noah
Bob Clark
reclark at adelphia.net
Fri Oct 14 16:53:58 CDT 2005
I'd love to get an electronic version of Bill Cosby's 'Bill Cosby is a very
funny gut', including the bit 'Noah', to show my daughters what good comedy
is. If willing to share, I can download at your convenience, please send
link to reclark at adelphia.net.
Thanks,
Bob
-----Original Message-----
From: geeks-bounces at sunhelp.org [mailto:geeks-bounces at sunhelp.org] On Behalf
Of geeks-request at sunhelp.org
Sent: Sunday, October 02, 2005 5:56 PM
To: geeks at sunhelp.org
Subject: geeks Digest, Vol 35, Issue 4
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Today's Topics:
1. WTB: Apple Airport w/ modem, (Patrick Giagnocavo 717-201-3366)
2. Re: Solaris resiliency to crashing w/full root partition?
(Charles Shannon Hendrix)
3. Re: Solaris resiliency to crashing w/full root partition?
(Charles Shannon Hendrix)
4. Re: Solaris resiliency to crashing w/full root partition?
(Charles Shannon Hendrix)
5. Re: Education (Charles Shannon Hendrix)
6. Re: Education (wa2egp at att.net)
7. Re: Solaris resiliency to crashing w/full root partition?
(velociraptor)
8. Re: Education (wa2egp at att.net)
9. Re: Education (Sridhar Ayengar)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Sun, 02 Oct 2005 00:46:12 -0400
From: Patrick Giagnocavo 717-201-3366 <patrick at zill.net>
Subject: [geeks] WTB: Apple Airport w/ modem,
To: rescue at sunhelp.org, geeks at sunhelp.org
Message-ID: <1128228372.6305.3.camel at localhost>
Content-Type: text/plain
I am looking for an Apple Airport (802.11b is fine) or other AP with the
ability to dialout with an included internal modem.
Please email me (patrick at zill.net) with what you have, and what you want for
it.
--Patrick
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Sun, 2 Oct 2005 00:40:35 -0400
From: Charles Shannon Hendrix <shannon at widomaker.com>
Subject: Re: [geeks] Solaris resiliency to crashing w/full root
partition?
To: The Geeks List <geeks at sunhelp.org>
Message-ID: <20051002044034.GC10216 at widomaker.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Sat, 01 Oct 2005 @ 12:00 -0700, Gregory Leblanc said:
> On Sat, 2005-10-01 at 12:24 -0400, Charles Shannon Hendrix wrote:
> > Else why would the taskbar clock depend on Evolution, the Gnome clone
> > of Microsoft Outlook, and things like that?
>
> Let's try to be acurate here. The taskbar clock depends on
> evolution-data-server, not Evolution.
Insignificant nit noted.
It's still bloody stupid.
--
shannon "AT" widomaker.com -- ["Consulting wouldn't be what it is today
without Microsoft Windows" -- Chris Pinkham]
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Sun, 2 Oct 2005 00:39:51 -0400
From: Charles Shannon Hendrix <shannon at widomaker.com>
Subject: Re: [geeks] Solaris resiliency to crashing w/full root
partition?
To: The Geeks List <geeks at sunhelp.org>
Message-ID: <20051002043950.GB10216 at widomaker.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Sat, 01 Oct 2005 @ 14:29 -0400, Phil Stracchino said:
> And this is just one more reason why I will NEVER, EVER run Gnome on my
> desktop.
Well, I run it because it does do a few things I like.
That, and my X configuration is 15 years old now, and I'm way too lazy
to update it. I stopped maintaining it two years ago, and it never was
the most fun thing to do.
I've been thinking about it though.
Oh, and if you run some of the Gnome/KDE applications without the
environment, they look horrible and/or lack critical functions.
Given how much software which I like now requires one or the other, it
is getting harder to just say no.
My machine is fast enough that it doesn't even notice the overhead of
Gnome, but I still hate just knowing it is there.
Some of the Gnome guys are OK though, and have made a lot of
improvements in performance. It just seems like they are a minority.
I also wonder if they can keep up as Gnome gets ever more ambitious.
Of course, even baseline operating systems are starting to get kind of
crazy.
Anyone looked closely at FreeBSD 5.x? They really crammed a lot of
stuff in there since 4.x.
...which reminds me:
http://www.dragonflybsd.org
I installed it today. Nice installer, no issues, and you can run it as
a live CD to play with it before installing.
--
shannon "AT" widomaker.com -- ["Consulting wouldn't be what it is today
without Microsoft Windows" -- Chris Pinkham]
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Sun, 2 Oct 2005 00:30:58 -0400
From: Charles Shannon Hendrix <shannon at widomaker.com>
Subject: Re: [geeks] Solaris resiliency to crashing w/full root
partition?
To: The Geeks List <geeks at sunhelp.org>
Message-ID: <20051002043057.GA10216 at widomaker.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Sat, 01 Oct 2005 @ 15:51 -0400, Nadine said:
> On 9/28/05, D.A. Muran-de Assereto <dmuran at tuad.org> wrote:
> > Not to be obnoxious, but it's probably not the auditor's fault. US
> Government
> > regs pretty much require this, and the auditor's personal opinion is
> largely
> > irrelevant.
>
> They are working from 3+ year old "best practices". I ran the
> audit script myself--it's a shell script *I* could write (as I've noted
> before my programming skills are far from top-of-the-line).
An audit program I had to run years ago tagged any processing of a
two-digit year field. Supposedly this was Y2K bug protection. However,
some code that it pointed out was only doing it for output formatting.
We had to remove the offending code, even though it was purely cosmetic:
all dates were processed without length issues (aka Y2K bugs).
It would have been only an irritating annoyance, except for one thing:
the two digit year output was a non-optional requirement for the program
to pass the audit.
> They check for nothing later than Solaris 7, and apparently the
> only Unices in the universe are Solaris, IRIX, AIX, and HP-UX.
> We'd be perfectly happy to comply with, say, current CIS best
> practices that take into account that you aren't putting a bare
> server onto the internet.
What do they do if you run it on a system and the script fails to run?
This reminds me of the idiot I used to work for that wanted us to run
Norton Antivirus on all Perl code we shipped out.
--
shannon "AT" widomaker.com -- ["Consulting wouldn't be what it is today
without Microsoft Windows" -- Chris Pinkham]
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Sun, 2 Oct 2005 01:00:58 -0400
From: Charles Shannon Hendrix <shannon at widomaker.com>
Subject: Re: [geeks] Education
To: The Geeks List <geeks at sunhelp.org>
Message-ID: <20051002050058.GD10216 at widomaker.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Sat, 01 Oct 2005 @ 19:29 -0500, Michael Parson said:
> She hates blanket policies too and recognizes that different students
> learn in different ways as well. But in her experience, most kids seem
> to do better with rules than phonics.
It does... *IF* the teachers are competent.
If a poor teacher or a poor curriculum is used, rules-based English is a
disaster.
> My parents let me read just about anything I wanted, whenever I wanted.
> I read encyclopedias, bibles, anything I could get my hands on. They
> just never got me any comic books, and I never really didn't know what I
> didn't have.
I never got into comic books either. Sci-fi and fantasy caught my eye
early, especially Asimov and Tolkien.
I read various "technical" magazines my father bought.
> I never really felt like I was behind. But a lot of my teachers would
> let me read in class if I was quiet and not disrupting the others.
> Never really knew that wasn't normal. =)
Note: I didn't feel like *I* was behind, I felt like the *SCHOOL* was
behind.
> Once I figured out the game, I was able to do pretty wellin junior
> high and high school. I found out that the 'honors' and 'gifted and
> talented' classes did more project based work and little, if any home
> work, definatly no busy work. More group oriented activities in class.
> I took those classes cuz they were less 'work' than the basic-level
> ones.
Hmmmm... where I went to school, the GT and AP classes were sometimes
mostly just more of the same.
However, English was pretty good. AP English was the first such class I
ever liked. I had been forbidden to take it for years because I was
"too dumb", but in reality it probably was what I needed.
I was also barred from taking computer science in high school.
A few AP classes were project based, and I wasn't allowed to take them
either.
Of course, if you were one of the rich kids or a military brat, you
could take whatever you pleased. The school catered to them at everyone
else's expense.
> College was a big slap in the face for me. I never learned how to
> really study or be a good student that the colleges were expecting.
I've never been a good student either, but in the colleges I attended
the combination of difficulty (which was shocking given the low quality
of my public education), and flexibility in how I studied, worked pretty
well for me. I suppose it forced me to change really fast to survive.
> I couldn't manipulated the system like I had in HS, at least, I didn't
> get it figured out in the short time I was there. The system was too
> big and too different from what I'd been in before.
I think it is sad that you ever have to learn to work the system. You
should just be able to study and get what you need.
> But I'd pretty much given up on the whole college thing by then. That
> one class wasn't enough to turn me around and get back into it. Classes
> kept getting in the way of me learning about how to run the VAX and Unix
> systems.
I always hated it when professors interrupted my programming work to
teach me how to program... :)
--
shannon "AT" widomaker.com -- ["Consulting wouldn't be what it is today
without Microsoft Windows" -- Chris Pinkham]
------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Sun, 02 Oct 2005 13:25:45 +0000
From: wa2egp at att.net
Subject: Re: [geeks] Education
To: The Geeks List <geeks at sunhelp.org>
Message-ID:
<100220051325.7947.433FDFD900055C8F00001F0B21602807419F090ACD0E99 at att.net>
> Why?
>
> The purpose of a grade is to show what you know.
>
> Grading a student down for homework who has demonstrated he has learned
> is just plain wrong, period.
>
> Of course, the whole idea of using grades as a permanent metric is
> rather dumb in the first place, but let's at least do what we claim to
> be doing.
>
> --
> shannon "AT" widomaker.com -- ["People should have access to the data
which
> you have about them. There should be a process for them to challenge any
> inaccuracies." -- Arthur Miller]
I get it now. You assumed the student learned it in the first place, so
why do it again. Unfortunately, that is not always the case.
Also, unfortunately, we are graded all our lives.....job performance,
credit rating, etc.
Bob
------------------------------
Message: 7
Date: Sun, 2 Oct 2005 13:14:01 -0400
From: velociraptor <velociraptor at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [geeks] Solaris resiliency to crashing w/full root
partition?
To: The Geeks List <geeks at sunhelp.org>
Message-ID:
<b9ce685f0510021014t765059f6y88d929fc12212571 at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
On 10/2/05, Charles Shannon Hendrix <shannon at widomaker.com> wrote:
> > They check for nothing later than Solaris 7, and apparently the
> > only Unices in the universe are Solaris, IRIX, AIX, and HP-UX.
> > We'd be perfectly happy to comply with, say, current CIS best
> > practices that take into account that you aren't putting a bare
> > server onto the internet.
>
> What do they do if you run it on a system and the script fails to run?
>
> This reminds me of the idiot I used to work for that wanted us to run
> Norton Antivirus on all Perl code we shipped out.
These guys ride the short bus, but I don't think I could convince
them that the script wouldn't run given that it uses "sh". :-)
That said, I was tempted to create some very crude host.allow/
host.deny files just to shut them up on "you don't run tcp wrappers".
Well, *duh*, nothing runs out of inetd. But my ethics kicked in. So, I
provided a detailed explanation as to how that wouldn't help things,
&c. Rowr, yet another RAF (risk acceptance form) to write.
Then our CSO wanted me to write up a similarly detailed explanation
on SUID/SGID files since I had stated that the IG's contention that
"having SUID/SGID files was a significant risk" was too broad to
address. I was like, great, I have to explain to idjits how UNIX works...
Fortunately we found the previous RAF for it. Yeah, a RAF for the
OS-installed SUID/SGID files!
=Nadine=
------------------------------
Message: 8
Date: Sun, 02 Oct 2005 17:26:59 +0000
From: wa2egp at att.net
Subject: Re: [geeks] Education
To: The Geeks List <geeks at sunhelp.org>
Message-ID:
<100220051726.18790.434018620006F4570000496621602807489F090ACD0E99 at att.net>
> Evidently, because I said the homework I had to do was busywork.
>
> I didn't say all of it was, and even suggested that removing most of it
> would allow the student to come up with their own.
>
I really doubt that would happen. Most students would not do any homework
whether they came up with it on their own or not.
> > That's part of the "feel-good" education. Does the student REALLY
> > know what they need or are we working with the 20-20 vision that
> > hind sight provides? I wish I knew exactly what each student needs so
> > I could tailor their education toward that.
>
> No, it isn't feel good, it's called learning properly.
In your opinion.
> Also, I didn't say anything about knowing what I needed.
You implied it. Many times. "....what I need..."
> But even a student knows when they have mastered a particular excersize,
> and repeating it doesn't help.
>
> For some people, maybe it does, but not everyone learns best by rote
> memorization and repetition.
Too much homework that is given is rote (depending on grade level) and
I know what you mean. I never give an assignment of "memorize the symbols
the of first twelve elements" as an example. Those can be learned as you
go from use. I don't know what you mean by mastering a particular exercise
because that could be interpreted two ways; memorize particular problems
(which seems to be what most of my students want to do) or learn a
particular
process like solve problems with, let's say, v = vi + at. (Then the
homework problems would have different unknowns so the equation is used in
various ways.) And we go over it the next day. I don't think that's
useless.
> You have a wierd notion of busywork.
Yes I do.
> It's busywork if it serves no useful purpose.
Wouldn't that be homework that is given and not reviewed so a
student could correct their mistakes/mis-learning?
> Wether or not the teacher looks at it has nothing to do with that.
At least it could count as something, even as an effort grade.
> > I don't call that busywork.
> > I don't call that feel-good education. I call that building self
> > esteem.
>
> It is busywork if the student is gaining nothing from it.
>
> You were just complaining about "feel good" education, most of which
> came out of a misplaced desire to build self esteem.
Actually the problem is the horse-before-the-cart illogic in the educational
system. Some one saw students with good grades having good self esteem so
it's only 'logical' that if you give the students good self esteem they will
get good grades. So they gave classes where students were "pumped
up" about how wonderful they are (without having to accomplish anthing).
Now we are getting students that feel so good about themselves, they don't
"have" to learn or do any work. "I'm here, therefore I deserve an A"
Yeah..sure. That is what call a "feel good" education.
I'd rather have a student feel good about themselves because they're able
to solve a problem or handle some kind of challenge whether they're
interested
in my subject or not. I see this when I go over homework that I assign.
If you think that's worthless...fine.
Bob
------------------------------
Message: 9
Date: Sun, 02 Oct 2005 17:55:30 -0400
From: Sridhar Ayengar <ploopster at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [geeks] Education
To: The Geeks List <geeks at sunhelp.org>
Message-ID: <43405752.5070700 at gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
wa2egp at att.net wrote:
>>Why?
>>
>>The purpose of a grade is to show what you know.
>>
>>Grading a student down for homework who has demonstrated he has learned
>>is just plain wrong, period.
>>
>>Of course, the whole idea of using grades as a permanent metric is
>>rather dumb in the first place, but let's at least do what we claim to
>>be doing.
>>
>>--
>>shannon "AT" widomaker.com -- ["People should have access to the data
which
>>you have about them. There should be a process for them to challenge any
>>inaccuracies." -- Arthur Miller]
>
>
> I get it now. You assumed the student learned it in the first place, so
> why do it again. Unfortunately, that is not always the case.
You're saying that a student can ace a test on the material without
learning the material? Then it's a bad test, and it's the teacher's fault.
Peace... Sridhar
------------------------------
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