[geeks] FW: [rescue] UPS Recommendation

[Mike Meredith]

On Thu, 17 Jul 2003 14:03:13 -0700
N.Miller <vraptor at promessage.com> wrote:
> You might want to check the crime statistics in Australia since
> guns were banned, if you don't believe this.  

I'm ignoring Australia because I don't know about it ...

> Ditto, England.

You aren't likely to find crime statistics for England seperate to the
figures for Wales as well (don't ever forget the Welsh ... they'll beat
you to death with leaks). I've had a look at the crime stats for E&W,
and it doesn't seem to show much except a fluctuating growth in the
overall level.

I can't see how gun control laws would have much influence on overall
crime statistics which are dominated by minor crimes ... jumping lights
and the like. So I took a look at murder rates.

Which shows a surpisingly static level from 1897 until about 1967/8 when
it shows a dramatic rise until it (very roughly) reaches double the
level in 1997 (739). The laws brought into effect after Hungerford
(1987?) don't seem to have much effect on the level of murder (in fact
the figures for 1988-1990 are less than 1987). The figures are at :-

http://www.police999.com/stats/figures10.html

Note that we already had a considerable level of gun control
legislation before Hungerford starting in 1870; increased in 1903 and
1920.

What seems commonly overlooked is that the UK has had several active
terrorist organisations incluencing the scene since the late 60's. Not
only did this have a direct effect on the level of crime (in particular
with violent crime committed with firearms), but would have had some
effect on the use of guns by the rest of the criminal world. After all
if the IRA is paying you to bring in 3 boxes of AK47's it isn't much
more difficult to bring in an extra box or two and use them yourself.

Whether or not you believe that gun control increases (or decreases)
crime, the UK probably isn't a good choice for comparison.

Besides which I'd bet that any effect that gun controls have on crime is
probably drowned in the noise caused by the effect of drugs laws.